How to learn programming and CS in the AI hype era – interview with prof Mark Mahoney [Podcast #215]

Today Quincy Larson interviews Mark Mahoney. He worked as a dev before becoming a computer science professor. He's taught computer science for 23 years at Carthage College, a 180-year-old US university. He's also taught thousands of developers through his free programming courses built on top of his own open source course platform, Playback Press. We talk about: - Why learning programming the hard way is still the right way - How to not deskill yourself when programming with LLM tools - And why now is a great time to study computer science Support for this podcast comes from the 10,113 kind folks who donate to our charity each month. Join them and support our mission at https://donate.freecodecamp.org Get a freeCodeCamp tshirt for $20 with free shipping anywhere in the US: https://shop.freecodecamp.org Links from our discussion: - Playback Press, Mark's free interactive courses: https://playbackpress.com/books - Mark's personal website: https://markm208.github.io/ - One of the many vibe-coded projects Mark mentions: https://markm208.github.io/vibeCodingInClassTools/git-workflow-simulator.html - Mark's tutorials on freeCodeCamp: https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/author/markm208/ Community news section: 1. freeCodeCamp just published a new course on AI-assisted software development. You'll learn common terminal workflows and tips for “pair programming” alongside LLM tools. You'll also get exposure to tools like GitHub Copilot, Claude Code, Gemini CLI, and OpenClaw. At the end of the day, the entire goal of using these tools is to build more features without compromising the maintainability of your codebase. (90 minute YouTube course): https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/ai-tools-for-developers/ 2. freeCodeCamp also published a beginner level course on AI literacy for everybody that you can also share with your family. First you'll learn about the two traits that definte artificial intelligence: autonomy and adaptivity. Then you'll build your own image classifier right on your own phone or laptop. This course also delves into considerations like algorithmic bias the environmental costs of training and running LLM systems. (1 hour YouTube course): https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/ai-literacy-for-everybody/ 3. Learn how to build your own QR code generator using JavaScript. This tutorial will walk you through generating QR codes entirely in a browser without the need for a backend. You'll learn how to validate input, clear previous output, and use a JavaScript library to render the code instantly on the client side. Then you'll see how to extend the project with downloads, custom styling, WiFi support, and more. (7 minute read): https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/how-to-build-a-qr-code-generator-using-javascript/ 4. I'm thrilled to announce that the Bad Website Club is back for another Responsive Web Design bootcamp based on freeCodeCamp's curriculum. It starts April 24 and runs for 10 weeks. You can join their Discord community and tune in for live streams. It's lead by volunteer devs who are passionate about helping folks learn CSS and JavaScript fundamentals. (5 minute read): https://www.freecodecamp.org/news/bad-website-club-bootcamp-based-on-freecodecamp-rwd-cert/ 5. Today's song of the week is 2008's Strange Overtones. The Talking Heads singer David Byrne blends his voice with Brian Enos, who handles organs and synths. The entire affair plays over an infectious palm-muted guitar line, and driving bass. This is a perfect mid-week jam. Put it on during during your commute. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvZhpCYWFzs